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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 23:08 
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Fergy wrote:
This is assuming the players not selected for the core group, will join other packs.


This is a very true and extremely important point. Reduce it to five and you force ONE person out. My pack from last round filled up without me. I decided to random and hang aruond anyway, but there is literally zero chance that I will actively go out and search for a new pack. Just not interested. I think that'd hold true for a lot of people, then it's gonna be easier to just quit.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 23:31 
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Rain wrote:
Fergy wrote:
This is assuming the players not selected for the core group, will join other packs.


This is a very true and extremely important point. Reduce it to five and you force ONE person out. My pack from last round filled up without me. I decided to random and hang aruond anyway, but there is literally zero chance that I will actively go out and search for a new pack. Just not interested. I think that'd hold true for a lot of people, then it's gonna be easier to just quit.


Yes, this is the reason why I think 5 is a no-go. Though mostly the core groups consist of 2-3 players, but still, booting just a one out would only create a one more competitive pack out in the field, and a few players would probably end up randoming/quitting. Going down to 4-packs leaves pairs to find/form new packs, I think that's a lot more friendly, and it creates more competitive packs.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 23:41 
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Wow, such involved posts in this thread for a game that hasn't had an admin who has cared about this game since...

...when did Viruz change his name again?

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 23:47 
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Yeah, 4 is better than 5, obviously. 1 more competitive pack (which most likely won't even be created) isn't gonna create that much more competition :)


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 00:42 
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smaller and non-power pack is fine.. i have been like that for a few rounds... just that u have to accept some frustrations or even miss opportunities due to less people contributing as a team. but, that is precisely what some one has mentioned before - it acts uncertainty to the game

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 01:01 
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Things I completely agree with:
  • Black Ops system is not good.
  • Tollspry need to sac more Emitters to get imps.
  • Reducing pack size is good.

Things I completely disagree with:
  • People should have something (meaningful) to do after failing.
  • The game has come to a "math-only" basis.

Ways to fix it?
Change the way black operations work. LINK
This is along the lines of what Peluin suggests:
Peluin wrote:
An alternative is to remove the dust cost of spells (or at least non-self spells) and take an approach that black ops should be available to everyone, not only to mage whores who are completely irrelevant otherwise. With some work this would be a far superior game design approach and add a new layer of complexity to top-level play, but to be honest I don't expect Elveron to change in such a radical and involved way.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 04:29 
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I feel kind of late on this but I also agree with Ceek.

I lol'ed in the RC many times

I also agree with your post here Quaffle

Also what is the official rule on when attacking can end. I would like to see it changed to can end with 11 or 12 hrs left at any time. And yes I understand xp can get hits off later than that but I feel the unknown factor of 4- ?? number of hours that attacking can be disabled is dumb. Like hitting with 8 hrs left would ONLY be for a suicide and I have seen it before where everyone has sent out and then a suicider comes along to CQ hit someone solely for them to lose land

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 02:30 
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Updated!

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The Age of Wisdom :: Round 4 :: 1 SmoochyWoochyPoochy
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 03:33 
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How about we make changes to the game that doesn't benefit hyperactive players as much. As of now, there is almost no chance to compete if you don't have active realmies or war declaration.

Please do something about rimps, war, relic, and bazaar heroes so new players can also compete.

If we don't take new players into consideration, the game will die in a few rounds (if it's not dead already).


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 05:48 
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Really you want tollspry to get half the amount of imps? Just take the race out then.
3/4 makes them reasonable. 1/3/6/12 is more reasonable. Even wilan's imps aren't all that great compared to other top players

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 07:47 
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The idea is that tollsprys will have to sack emitters to imp to a much larger extent than this round. I dont know about other tollsprys, but i believe Valg didnt sack a single one. Granted we gave him a huge rimp discount, but his kimps were pretty huge too.

This is a big nerf, but Tollsprys were a bit too powerful last round and then it could be argued that a longer round might be more advantageous for Tollspry as well.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 08:58 
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Dante wrote:
The idea is that tollsprys will have to sack emitters to imp to a much larger extent than this round.


make emmiter--> GK conversion larger compared to lower tier mili --> GK conversion.

the previous round imp is not sufficient for tollspyrs, this round they are basically doubled . why not make it something in between rather than going back to insufficient imping.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 09:21 
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hiraishin wrote:
Dante wrote:
The idea is that tollsprys will have to sack emitters to imp to a much larger extent than this round.


make emmiter--> GK conversion larger compared to lower tier mili --> GK conversion.

the previous round imp is not sufficient for tollspyrs, this round they are basically doubled . why not make it something in between rather than going back to insufficient imping.


With insufficient you mean insufficient without saccing emitters. The original race concept currently isn't even in the race, as you'll get 80m imp points within 6 weeks without saccing a single emitter. Halving that to 40m is still huge, but you'll have to do some saccing to get great imps, especially early round.

Even with halved imps their gold per diamond beats any other race than minotaur past early round and their gold per point for units isn't bad. Only the train times are.

If there's a popular demand to not nerf the race so much, I'd suggest slapping their worker with -10g, though then they'd possibly need a nerf on exploration.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 09:35 
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Ceekayed wrote:
hiraishin wrote:
Dante wrote:
The idea is that tollsprys will have to sack emitters to imp to a much larger extent than this round.


make emmiter--> GK conversion larger compared to lower tier mili --> GK conversion.

the previous round imp is not sufficient for tollspyrs, this round they are basically doubled . why not make it something in between rather than going back to insufficient imping.


With insufficient you mean insufficient without saccing emitters. The original race concept currently isn't even in the race, as you'll get 80m imp points within 6 weeks without saccing a single emitter. Halving that to 40m is still huge, but you'll have to do some saccing to get great imps, especially early round.

Even with halved imps their gold per diamond beats any other race than minotaur past early round and their gold per point for units isn't bad. Only the train times are.

If there's a popular demand to not nerf the race so much, I'd suggest slapping their worker with -10g, though then they'd possibly need a nerf on exploration.


yes w/o saccing 7/7.

my point is. there was a drastic buff in imping last round and they are powerful, and now we are making a drastic nerf? i think somewhere in between would work out just fine. :)


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:24 
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I wouldnt mind slapping a -10g on the worker of tollspry as Ceek alluded to. I think tollspry should be a fast race, and -10g on worker will make sure they are fast at least untill they start sacking for imps.

-10g worker means -2.94% to the price of harmonizer, and since everything else comes from harmonizer it means -2.94% gpp to ALL units.

It is a pretty big buff, but i wouldnt mind it since i think good alignment could use something very fast.

Edit. By comparison, slapping a similar price decrease to human would mean roughly:
Footman -10g
Pikeman -10g
Longbowman -30g
Knight -35g


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