I don't really know how masons or cultists work, so I checked here: http://wiki.epicmafia.com/index.php/Cultist



If this is how masons and cultists work, then the obvious thing to do is just fricking kill them at night. According to the same site, masons go before cultists at night and killing the cult leader kills all the cultists. Frankly, at this point it would be less helpful for you to try to convert people at night anyway. There are likely a couple strong citizen roles around that it would be bad for you to convert, and there is an increasing chance that you could accidentally convert a mafia, which would kill you both and be rather counterproductive. So what are you going to do tonight? Convert me? Screw that, I like my role.

What I'm getting at is this:

Players
Alive
Wonderland
Graduated Plum
B
Cobra08
modoom
Intrepid_Death
knicoal
Witch King
Robespierre
popcorn10
Jelme
Neodymium

Now, let's divide this into categories according to your (as yet unproven) claims.

Cits
Wonderland - probably?
Intrepid_Death - Darn skippy I'm putting my name here.

Masons - by your claims
Graduated PLum
MoD

Cultists - again, by your claims
B
knicoal

Other people
Cobra08
Witch King
Robespierre
popcorn10
Jelme
Neodymium

Now, I have reason to believe that one other person I know of is likely to be a citizen, and it's likely, if what you say is true, that there is one more cultist in there. That leaves four people. There are likely either one or two mafia in that group of four people. So, if you kill the cult leader today and you were going to mason someone tonight, you would end up with possibly a 2/4 chance (2/5 if you include Wonderland as a possible target) that you would mason a mafia, which would kill you both. Not a good idea, in my opinion.

However, if what you're saying is true, then you are perfectly capable of killing the cult leader tonight. Also, if what you're saying is true, there are only 5 people capable of being mafia. Why would you give up a chance to lynch a mafia?

That's why I don't think your post makes sense.

Now, only you, Plum, and MoD have been saying all this about a cult and masons and such. You said that if we don't lynch the cult leader today, who you say is knicoal, and they cult another person, they'll have an unstoppable majority and we'll all lose. How? Last time I counted, there were 12 players still alive. If we assume that there are 3 cultists and that they can cult one other person tonight, and the mafia will kill one person tonight, then tomorrow there will be 11 people. 4 of them would be cultists. That's hardly a majority. Plus, if you're right about knicoal being the cult leader, then anyone could kill her at any time and the entire cult would die. That's not very frightening. Hell, even if they cult someone tomorrow and we lynch the cult leader tomorrow, there'll be 7 people left, with at most 2 of them mafia, so it isn't even as if killing the cult leader tonight or tomorrow would give the mafia a majority either. So why, exactly, is it that you're making such a panic?

In essence, this is what I've garnered from your posts. You two are on a team. You claim that you are masons, which I do not yet have a reason to believe. You claim that knicoal and B are cultists, which I also do not yet have a reason to believe. You claim that it is imperative that knicoal is lynched today, which, as I have shown, is not the case, even if she were the cult leader. Technically, you don't even know if she is the cult leader. So it all comes down to these possibilities:

1. You two aren't lying. You are masons, knic and B are cultists, along with possibly one other person. Either knic or the other person is cult leader, and they're easily mopped up.

2. You two are lying. Since you are a team, maybe you are the mafia. Since your actions would be so damned odd for mafia I'm inclined to believe that this would not be the case, but who knows. The only possible strategy I could think of that would be behind this one is that you convince the cits to lynch knic today, and when B doesn't die tomorrow you say that knic wasn't the cult leader so the mystery third was the cult leader, which would give you the ability to conduct a witch hunt after random people that aren't part of your duo.

3. You two are lying. Since you are a team, maybe you are the cultists. This would make more sense than the mafia if you thought you could get rid of the masons, who are your primary obstacle in winning. Due to the fact that this is the third day and it would be stupid for the cult leader to make himself a target, I would think that this would imply that there is a third person who is cult with you who is hiding and is the cult leader.

Personally, I'd like to hear B and knic's responses before I try to figure out which one is true.

_________________
When I was a kid, we had a quicksand box in the backyard. I was an only child . . . eventually.

Firstly, I have no idea where you pulled the fact that MoD is a mason from.

There are MORE than enough cleared citizens in anyone's books to be sure not to mason a mafia. We ALL know that.

And again, we haven't lynched a mafia yet. A killer and traitor, both third party roles. That means we have 3 or 4 mafia left, not 2.

I've not gotten much info on the mason role, so I can't tell you if we can kill knic at night. Lynching knic in the day is far more beneficial, instead of wasting a mason on the cult leader, we could be creating a voting block. Lynching a mafia should not be done on small 'chance', at this point in the game, we still have doc and cop (assuming we had those to begin with) and multiple other power roles. We've got an equal chance to lynch either. I'd rather be sure.

4 cultists, 3-4 mafia, 2-3 masons and likely 2 citz tomorrow if we don't lynch knicoal (not accounting what we actually do lynch). Do you realise how much power we'd be giving the mafia if we let that happen? They could kill knicoal tonight and knock out 3-4 players, giving themselves almost a majority. They could wait another night and knock out 5 players, and give themselves complete majority, mafia winning obviously. You're banking on being able to lynch a mafia each day AND someone else killing knicoal. Both those assumptions will EASILY lose the citz the game.

Someone else killing knicoal is very frightening, that's why it has to happen now. If it doesn't, it's cult vs mafia. It's that simple.

"Do not yet have reason to believe." Is anyone still doubting me being citz? Really? It hardly matters what role I am anymore anyway. Used up BP/Mason isn't any different of a role, ty.

Situations 2&3 ^ refer to that comment.

I would also like to hear B and Knic.

_________________
I want the public schools to leave my children alone. No condoms, no heterosexual ed. Under the guise of sex ed, public schools are trying to instill un-Catholic views into our children. The public schools, and the gay lobby, want access to MY CHILDREN.

I am at work all day, I will be back in 4hrs I think

what the heck, so many long posts.... lemme read some of it...

/me grumbles

_________________
GUILD WARS 2 NOAW

Jelme - This may sound weird, but I always wanted to setup a porno website starring my friends wife. She'd make a killing. She looks like she is 12.
Me - i have no idea how to take that or respond. i think if i respond i get fired :)

hrm, knic and wk wanna lynch me, others are lynching knic....



I vote to lynch WK

_________________
GUILD WARS 2 NOAW

Jelme - This may sound weird, but I always wanted to setup a porno website starring my friends wife. She'd make a killing. She looks like she is 12.
Me - i have no idea how to take that or respond. i think if i respond i get fired :)

I don't think i bolded my last vote.

I vote to lynch Neo

_________________
Mynn L says:
I LOVE YOU ADAM

OK WTF.

First of all- B screwed up for the whole cultist thing. He openly admitted to me that he was cultist, and that knicoal AND ID are cult. Knicoal is the leader. Yeah- it is a huge screwup. Not that I couldn't have figured it out by myself, but still he just CONFIRMED it.

So yeah- still best situation for citizens AND mafia, is to vote cult leader. That is KNICOAL. FFS. Not neo- WK or pcorn.

So the people who arent voting knicoal- gief explanation please.

_________________
» J o b zegt:
you like pee?
Nicole zegt:
ya
smell AND taste
feels nice too tho
esp when it spashes in yer eyes and mouth

you guyds sre all scumy. vote to lynch mod

WTF

_________________
Mynn L says:
I LOVE YOU ADAM

OH and i didn't see the votes on knic. ANYTIME i can kill knic off i will gladly accept.

I change my vote to lynch knic

_________________
Mynn L says:
I LOVE YOU ADAM

agreed.

I vote to lynch MoD

_________________
WARNING: Quaffles is a whiny bitch, and he will complain to adminz if you say anything negative about him in your signature.

So how does cultist's work? Knicoal is the leader, so if she is killed at night all of the cultist's die? But during the day if she is killed, they dont? What happens to the other cultists?

I'm guessing this stuff is verified from external communications. It sorta makes sense.

_________________
[17:48] Shawn: are you drunk or are you stupid?
[18:00] P_corn: I'd go with stupid

Huh. I guess I just assumed that MoD was the other mason.

So you're going to intentionally mason a cleared citizen? That's not necessarily a bad idea, except that some people have powerful roles. Once again, it's counterproductive to mason powerful, cleared cits. Hell, masons are useless at night after a while. The only people you should be trying to mason are third party roles and cultists.

Where are you getting the assumption that there are three or four mafia left? Did quaffle ever say that there were a certain number? Besides, if there are 3 or 4 mafia remaining, wouldn't that make it all the more imperative that we lynch one today? Since the freaking rules seem to state that masons can kill cultists at night, and in your own opinion most of the unknown people alive are mafia, you are useless at night now except to kill cultists. So by doing this, even if you aren't lying, which is becoming increasingly suspicious, you would just be wasting a lynch.



Wait, wait, what? So I disagree with jumping to conclusions just because two people tell us to lynch a third, and now I'm one of the targets? How the hell does that one work out? In my not so humble opinion, that's fairly fishy. Nice touch with the whole "if you don't vote with us you better explain yourselves!" thing.

Once again, all the information that we have pointing out some cult or whatnot is coming purely from two people.



Unless you're Jesus, stay dead.



Apparently, as long as the cult leader is killed ever, all cultists die. This stuff has only been "verified" for two people. Only two people are claiming anything of the sort. Generally, I wouldn't think that two people would have this much sway when there is, as of yet, no reason to believe them.

_________________
When I was a kid, we had a quicksand box in the backyard. I was an only child . . . eventually.

Oh my god. There are so many mistakes in your post.



Ok, plem is cleared BP - therefore his role became useless. Now he got masoned, that means that plem can also trust the other mason for sure.


When the risk is too big- masons shouldnt mason. So they should create a voting block. They do that- by masoning useless citizens.



Nope. For both citizens and mafia it is in their best interest to get rid of the third party first. Them getting too big is a hazard- but also being culted and when knicoal gets killed is a hazard! So yeah- knicoal / cult must die.

You aren't a target, knicoal still is. It is just bad luck for you that you got culted as well. That must feel so bad. I still like to know good reasons of you why you think knicoal isn't a hazard to you. [ that is, assuming you aren't cult- which you are. I just like to hear some more crap you spit. ]



LOLOLOL OMG. Yes offCOURSE only two people. I play EM, and I have done it a LOT. Jeez.


Enough reason to believe me now e h?

_________________
» J o b zegt:
you like pee?
Nicole zegt:
ya
smell AND taste
feels nice too tho
esp when it spashes in yer eyes and mouth

That's debatable.



I said that SOME people have powerful roles, sparky. I didn't mention the choice to mason Plum, I was pointing out that masoning certain people of the remaining group would be rather silly. And technically, he was never cleared so much as deemed "probably innocent." It's completely viable that there is a mafia version of the BP, especially as quaffle seems to have made up roles in the previous game.



Which is irrelevant right now. At this moment, most of the people remaining are either cits with strong roles or, if Plum is to believed, mafia.



Since no matter how many times I post it you still seem to ignore the obvious, IF YOU ARE REALLY A MASON YOU CAN KILL KNICOAL OR WHOEVER THE HELL IS A CULTIST AT NIGHT. If you really think that knicoal is a cultist and cultists must die, that is the obvious thing to do, since it would allow you to focus on killing the mafia, which would be the other major threat to you. I'll repeat this. There are two threats to Masons: Cult and Mafia. You can kill the Cult tonight, without any difficulty. You cannot kill the Mafia at night. The choice there is obvious.



You're missing something. Anyone you claim as being a Cultist is inherently one of your targets. If you manage to lynch knicoal today, when B and I don't die, then tomorrow you'll claim, "Oh, it must have been ID that was really the cult leader!" Then, I would be lynched. Now, if you're mafia, that gives you two night kills and two day kills. If there are really three of you and one of you is hiding, it would be an easy way of creating a situation which is nearly a guaranteed victory.



This is just confusing. What do you mean, offCOURSE only two people? So, if any two people make this claim it is obvious that it must be true? What kind of logic is that? And frankly, who gives a flying fuck how much you've played EM? It certainly doesn't seem to make any of your points any more valid.



...

I've been saying that same damned thing for a number of posts now. That isn't a reason for anything. Plus, in case you missed it I'll quote part of that again.



Since you acknowledge that this is how the role works, you no longer have any excuse not to kill knic tonight if you are really Mason and she is really Cult. The only reasons I can think of that you would continue to try to lynch her today is either that you are both idiots or you are lying and are members of the Mafia or the Cult.

_________________
When I was a kid, we had a quicksand box in the backyard. I was an only child . . . eventually.